Author Topic: Network 2017  (Read 1202 times)

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Offline vnguyen

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Network 2017
« on: August 28, 2017, 10:27:36 AM »
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Announced today
 
Changes include -

Green Rapid
* The Green Rapid will have more frequent trips between the City and Woden with buses departing every 15 minutes or better between 7am to 7pm, Monday to Friday.
* The introduction of the Green Rapid will see changes to existing Routes 4 & 5.
* Route 5 will no longer run and the Route 4 will see a number of changes to its route and frequency and direction.
* The Green Rapid and Route 4 will no longer service Constitution Avenue and Russell. Passengers will be able to connect to Russell at the City Bus Station or Barton Bus Station on the Red Rapid.
* For passengers travelling to the Canberra Outlet Centre or through to Woden, the Green Rapid and new Route 4 are designed to connect passengers along Goyder Street, Red Hill.
* Red Hill passengers will see some Route 4 service stops removed along La Perouse Street.

Black Rapid
* The Black Rapid will be the fastest service connecting passengers between the Gungahlin and Belconnen Town Centres. The Black Rapid will continue to be the Route 250, however it will no longer service Baldwin Drive.
* The Black Rapid buses depart every 15 minutes or better between 7am to 7pm, Monday to Friday.
* The Black Rapid will no longer service Baldwin Drive, Haydon Drive or College Street, however this impact has been reduced by increasing frequency on Routes 54 and 30.

Blue Rapid
* Effective 7 October 2017 a 7 day Blue Rapid (Route 300) will come into effect.
* This change to the network will mean that the Route 900 will no longer be in service.
* Passengers from Erindale will see the Route 971 frequency increased and extended to Woden where connections can be made to City and other destinations.
* The 932 will operate from Woden to City only.

Xpressos
* Effective 9 October 2017, Xpresso services, 712, 714, 743, 744 and 717 will complete their trip in the City Bus Station where passengers can connect to services 1, 2, 3, 6 or 200ís to complete their journey to Barton and Parliamentary Triangle.

19/319 and 18/318
Passengers who use routes 18/318 and 19/319 are advised that the following changes will come into effect from 9 October 2017:
* Blue Rapid services will now extend to Lanyon.
* The route 19/319 as it travels through Bonython will now become the Route 18/318
* The Route 18/318 as it travels past Bonython will become the route 19/319

Weston Line
* The Route 182 will now extend into Denman Prospect, Monday to Friday. Connecting passengers to Cooleman Court, the City and Weston Creek.
* Park and Ride facilities are available at Weston Creek where passengers can connect with the Route 182 into the City. Services are available Monday to Friday.

City Bus Station
* Effective 7 October 2017 Platforms 10 and 11 will no longer be in use for services in preparation for works on the Northbourne Plaza.
* Charter services will still operate from Platform 10 and 11 in the City Bus Station.
* Passengers are advised to check departure times and locations prior to their travel.

Dickson Interchange
* Effective 7 October 2017 Dickson Interchange will be open for bus services.
* Passengers are advised to check routes, departure times and locations prior to their travel.
* Routes 1, 7, 8, and 39 during the week and 930, 931, 936 and 937 on weekends will service Dickson Interchange connecting you to Red Rapid services along Northbourne Avenue to continue to the City and beyond.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 11:00:52 AM by Barry Drive »

Offline Busfanatic101

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2017, 11:49:23 AM »
Funnily enough the article and the links to pages that went over changes have all been locked in the last 10 minutes or so.
Whoops, premature announcement.

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2017, 12:02:11 PM »
I did think it was unusual to release maps and timetables so soon. But there may be a less detailed announcement this week, if not today.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 12:53:06 PM by Barry Drive »

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2017, 12:11:15 PM »
I luckily downloaded the map before it got locked out. Here us what route 4 and the green rapid looks like.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 12:53:51 PM by Barry Drive »

Offline Busfanatic101

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2017, 12:21:36 PM »
I luckily got  doabloaded the map before it got lockked out. Here us what route 4 and the green rapid looks like.
Good. Much more sensible than the current 4/5. Can you attach the full pdf/s if you have them?

Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2017, 12:25:19 PM »
Blue Rapid
* Effective 7 October 2017 a 7 day Blue Rapid (Route 300) will come into effect.
* This change to the network will mean that the Route 900 will no longer be in service.
* Passengers from Erindale will see the Route 971 frequency increased and extended to Woden where connections can be made to City and other destinations.

Wow, they finally decided to pull their thumbs out of their asses...


So what'll be the timetable book layout this time? Same as before? or will they save paper for once by mixing the weekend areas with their weekday counterparts?

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2017, 12:33:28 PM »
Full network map.

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2017, 12:58:35 PM »
Did you get the weekend map as well?

Good. Much more sensible than the current 4/5.
I'm not sure people who live in Narrabundah or Red Hill will agree with you. La Perouse St, Carnegie Cr, McKinlay St no longer serviced. No direct route from Red Hill or Narrabundah Shops to Woden. Possibly reduced frequency during the day (can't tell without timetable). Might have been better to go with Carnegie, Caley Cr then Goyder.

And it looks like it's meant to turn right from McMillan onto Canberra Ave.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2017, 01:00:59 PM by Barry Drive »

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2017, 01:10:43 PM »
No I didnt get the weekend map. But there so no change of frequency to route 4 as I can tell. It looks like 30mins for the whole day.

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2017, 01:15:18 PM »
Route 4 timetable. On closer inspection it turn onto Canberra Ave via Nyang southbound d and a McMillan Cres northbound

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2017, 01:32:36 PM »
On closer inspection it turn onto Canberra Ave via Nyang southbound d and a McMillan Cres northbound
Thanks for that. That's the more sensible route. And 30 minute frequency is good too.

Less sure about whether it needs to go to Fyshwick - it could have made use of the existing Narrabundah terminus or even the Railway Station instead.

Offline Busfanatic101

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2017, 02:14:25 PM »
I'm not sure people who live in Narrabundah or Red Hill will agree with you. La Perouse St, Carnegie Cr, McKinlay St no longer serviced. No direct route from Red Hill or Narrabundah Shops to Woden. Possibly reduced frequency during the day (can't tell without timetable). Might have been better to go with Carnegie, Caley Cr then Goyder.
Less sure about whether it needs to go to Fyshwick - it could have made use of the existing Narrabundah terminus or even the Railway Station instead.
All the streets you mention are 500m of the Green Rapid, parts of which are also close to the 4 which means additional frequency than present. The time savings would be quite significant with only a slight increase in average walking distance.


It is however a good point that you mention about a direct service to Woden on the 4 which I agree with. I would keep this new 4 route to Dalrymple, then take the current route from there to Woden. Kootara and Marina are within walking distance of the 200 and the Green Rapid (perhaps add a stop opposite Narrabundah College and Sturt near Karloo) for connections to Barton, Fyshwick, or Woden and can be cut.




Another interesting minor change is sending the 101 up Lonsdale and down Mort Street

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2017, 02:41:08 PM »
It did say "For passengers travelling to the Canberra Outlet Centre or through to Woden, the Green Rapid and new Route 4 are designed to connect passengers along Goyder Street, Red Hill."

Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2017, 04:07:17 PM »
Looking at that map I can see many improvements I would've put into a network design of my own.

-The fix-up of the 4,5,6 looks more tidy less 'streamlined', although once again quite a few bus stops will no longer be in service with the change which is somewhat concerning for those residents.
-About time they changed the 250 to not be a time wasting route - I mean the 51 took just as long to get from G to B on quite midday routes... glad to see they're fixing that.
-21/22 back to the way it was before the works
-a few more not worth mentioning
-and lots of scattered inconveniences as per usual every here and there.

Can't wait! ^-^

Any news on what the bus books will be? I would probably imagine in area format again, although I'm hoping they put the weekend areas together instead of a separate book, cause that would be so much easier.

Offline Bus 400

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #14 on: August 28, 2017, 07:10:18 PM »
What a lot have to remember is that there has been a semi direct route between Narrabundah & City since atleast the 1950's. If a route isn't popular, they don't last 60 odd years. These people started catching buses as children & as old people still catching buses from the same area. Now the elderly are expected to walk further or get up at stupid times for the flexibus.

Your main patronage of the current 5 coming from City Kingston, Manuka, Griffith Narrabundah, Canberra Hospital & Woden, there's your Green Rapid right there. The 4 could then meander around Red Hill & continue onto Fyshwick.

The only advantage of the remoal of the Sturt Ave crossover at McMillan St is lost by a right turn from McIntyre Street.

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Offline stephend723

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #15 on: August 28, 2017, 08:10:35 PM »
Someone tell me the 930 and 931 go to civic!?


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Offline King of Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #16 on: August 28, 2017, 09:38:22 PM »
Another interesting minor change is sending the 101 up Lonsdale and down Mort Street

Torrens St, actually.

The fix-up of the 4,5,6 looks more tidy less 'streamlined'

What? Isn't the aim to have tidy, streamlined services? Not tidy, indirect services? Personally, I'm still not a fan of the new 4/6 arrangement. Fyshwick seems to far out of the way to send it and it could just as easily serve a few more stops with little to no extra time added. I'd have made the 4/5 a bi-directional loop connecting with the 6 at Manuka (and possibly Goyder). The 6 wouldn't have to go through Griffith that way either.

About time they changed the 250 to not be a time wasting route - I mean the 51 took just as long to get from G to B on quite midday routes... glad to see they're fixing that.

How often do you use 250s? It at most only ever takes 30 mins, but often can take as little as 25 (or slightly less), which isn't that different from the end to end timings on the new Black Rapid 250. The only difference is that you're missing out on a massive patronage provider that is UC (College St). Now it will only serve the residences end of UC and later the UC Hospital which has the 51/52/54 anyway to Gungahlin (in the current network). Regardless, never have I had a 250 take as long/longer than a 51/52. Quite possible that the time this may have happened to you the 250 in question could've been caught in one or both the Barton Hwy/Gundaroo Dr roundabout and Gundaroo Dr roadworks.



Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #17 on: August 28, 2017, 09:49:00 PM »
If anything, I would prefer to have a bus network that is 'convenient' as apposed to streamlined, and looking at the map again, some of the 4/5/6 design doesn't look convenient enough, esp for the Narrabundah and east Red Hill residents.


Practically never, but the time I had the choice between getting a 51 or 250 to belco, I got the 51 cause it was the oldest bus of the two. The times for departure were roughly the same, but the 51 got to Belconnen 2 minutes after the 250, yet the 250 is suppose to be the express. I checked the times in my bus books before boarding just to see if I had the time, of which I did, but it didn't really matter due to how slow the 250 was to be anyway, cause with the 250 not taking the Girilang whatever pass-by detour, it saves 10-15 minutes (variable depending on time of day) at the very least per route - just sayin'.

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #18 on: August 31, 2017, 12:48:52 PM »
Weekend map is now out is now. 935 & 938 now mimics routes 4 and 6

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2017, 12:52:43 PM »
Also 935 is hourly whilst 938 is now every half hour.

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2017, 01:17:49 PM »
Other changes I noticed. 932 now splits to routes 930 & 931 now terminates at Dickson instead of the city. Route 200 is now a 7 day route. No Black Rapid route equivalent or Weston Line.

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2017, 01:29:39 PM »


No Black Rapid route equivalent or Weston Line.
Yep. Didn't even modify 983 to run to Denman Prospect - which would have been a simple fix.


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Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2017, 07:20:09 PM »
So 2017 pretty much marks the fall of the 900 series ...hooray!

Offline Bus 503

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2017, 08:31:36 PM »
Is there any reason why there is a route 30 at 2:50pm and again at 2:59pm from Cohen Street? I doubt there will still be passengers waiting for a route 30 9 minutes after the 2:50pm service.

Offline vnguyen

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2017, 08:35:31 PM »
It that bus on school days? ( I haven't seen the timetable)

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #25 on: September 01, 2017, 11:46:24 AM »
It that bus on school days? ( I haven't seen the timetable)
Yes. The 1459 departure is marked as S.

Offline Northside

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #26 on: September 01, 2017, 10:55:03 PM »
Some good and bad news for the 200 series. Running every 15 mins on the weekend = good news. No more 202 and a massive reduction in Barton and Russell services during peak (now down to every 10-15 min from the 4-5 min currently) = bad. In fact, Barton has lost all of its peak runs. So more pax will be forced to transfer. Does anyone know where all of that extra capacity has been redistributed?

Offline Busfanatic101

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2017, 11:30:49 AM »
2 transport officers have just come through updating the timetables in the display slots on the stops on my street for next week's network

Offline triumph

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #28 on: October 03, 2017, 09:22:51 PM »
The timetable displayed on the City bound side at the Parkes Place (National Gallery) stop is also already the new timetable. This is thoroughly misleading for users, particularly at this stop which is in a high visitor area (and it is also school holidays).

Today we were hopefully waiting for the 1.32pm route 1 service which never appeared. The 1.33pm didn't show either. It was then that a closer look revealed that the 1.33pm was a route 6! And the penny dropped. Fortunately, the next rte 3 took us to where we wanted to go in Turner but at the penalty of roaming around the University first. (Yes, could have carried a current timetable or smsed the stop number but that is not the point.)

Offline 743

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2017, 09:53:44 PM »
They have to be updated at some point, triumph. We can't expect them to do all the stops overnight. All the posters have an effective date - if that date is in the future, then the poster is not yet current. Simple.

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Offline triumph

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #30 on: October 04, 2017, 11:47:09 PM »
Yes 743, 'simple' for a bus enthusiast.

What ordinary user, let alone visitor, checks the small print effective date? And even if done, it only gives the effective date not the expiry date. So, for an effective date many months back, how can the user know for certain it is still current? Note that with the current timetable there are at least two effective dates depending on routes served. Any route 3 stop with a timetable has a much more recent effective date than other stops. Our perfect pedantic date checking user, seeing the route 3 date and later seeing the older date eleswhere, might reasonably think the older timetable is just that, an old out of date one. A normal user, quite reasonably, simply trusts that the operating authority has the correct timetable displayed. Even an enthusiast might not reasonably expect the new timetable to be in place 4 working days ahead of the effective date.

Agreed that it takes time to alter all the displayed at stops timetables (how many stops with displayed timetables are there, is an inetersting question?). Two points, firstly a prominent warning sticker would ameliorate the risk of mis-information (which, for example, could potentially be very disruptive for an ordinary user checking a timetable at the stop across the road to plan a return trip). Secondly, of all the stops, it is totally inappropriate to display the new timetable early at stops in high tourist/visitor areas. These should surely have been done last on Friday.

I do not resile from my point, that at a stop such as at the National Gallery, displaying, without any special alerting, the 'wrong' timetable is very misleading.


Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #31 on: October 05, 2017, 08:27:35 AM »
Oh I totally agree with you. I was out yesterday traveling around parts of Southern Canberra and Southlands. I came across at least 6 timetables throughout the day of which I needed to know if and when a bus was coming, but because the times were changed on the few that had times, I couldn't know if it was as accurate without checking my own bus books - which can also be inaccurate cause you have to guess but can't guess the early/lateness of a bus

As with replacements, I am certain they have also replaced the timetables at bus stops a week in advanced due, it is a problem for the things you've already mentioned, but with Canberra having something like 6000 bus stops and at least a third of them having timetable slots (that number is a guess, it's likely less), there's at least 100 man hours of work needed to the whole lot. With how many transport officers there are now days, you'd think that could be done over the weekend, and it's only been a couple of days and already I've seen most timetable stops replaced, only the interchanges and bus stations remain.
Sure, they could've waited maybe a few more days, like starting it today or something.

Offline Barry Drive

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #32 on: October 05, 2017, 09:29:47 AM »
... you'd think that could be done over the weekend,

Thing is though, the changes start on the weekend. I think that may be the main reason why the stop timetables have been changed early.

Which is worse - new timetables or out of date timetables? (Or none at all)

Yes, you could put a sticker on the timetable or even tape the old timetable to the holder, but then you have to repeat the process of removing the sticker or old timetable.

Offline Busnerd

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #33 on: October 05, 2017, 05:17:59 PM »
Not only gunzels but anyone with a brain who knows how to read a timetable may consider checking that.

The same way someone in a supermarket might check the special ticket to see when the special ends.

Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #34 on: October 05, 2017, 05:46:23 PM »
Which is worse - new timetables or out of date timetables? (Or none at all)

Definitely out of date ones, though it may as well be none at all considering how few bus stops I use and have seen around Canberra actually have them.

Offline triumph

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #35 on: October 05, 2017, 10:00:59 PM »
How many supermarket customers check specials validity on the shelf card? Only a miniscule percentage I suggest (excepting those intending to come back next day or later to make the pruchase). It is a question of expectation. If the special is displayed at the shelf, then that's what you get. If you don't, then refund or often free is what you get when queried at the enquiry counter. Quite different with on-line promos where the period of availability is important for forward planning. It is all a question of ordinary user expectations.

Funnily enough, the theoretical example I quoted of checking the return time, actually occurred for real today at Charnwood. A woman followed me off the bus, crossed the road and looked at the timetable and made notes. I also needed to cross the road and approached her and asked if she was planning her return. Yes she was and she had no idea the timetable was the new one not yet in use. "It looked old" was her comment. True, the panel material in front of the timetable was faded a bit.




Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #36 on: October 08, 2017, 09:52:40 AM »
Guess who forgot to go pick up a copy of each book for the new network?

...yup me >:(
hate this new distribution system... use to be so much easier

Offline Bus 400

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #37 on: October 08, 2017, 01:39:42 PM »
Just pop into the City & ask them nicely.

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Offline Sylvan Loves Buses

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #38 on: October 08, 2017, 03:17:47 PM »
It's all gud, got some from the guy in Woden today

12 of the required 21 8)

Offline Northside

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Re: Network 2017
« Reply #39 on: October 20, 2017, 12:05:33 AM »
So does anyone have any observations on the new timetable? How well are the free services being patronised? Is there a noticed improvement or degradation for those affected?