Canberrans Demanding Action on ACTION

[ACTIONonACTION]

Our group, Canberrans Demanding Action on ACTION, is devoted to fixing the appalling state of ACT Public Transport. We are a volunteer, not-for-profit organisation. At present, we are in the process of establishing and building a profile on this issue. Our ultimate goal is to make Canberra's public transport system an election issue in October 2012.

We also oppose the sale of ACTION and firmly believe Canberra's interests are best served by public transport remaining in public hands.

You can visit our website at http://www.actiononaction.org.au. We can be contacted by email at actiononaction@gmail.com. We're also on Facebook at http://www.facebook.com/pages/Canberrans-Demanding-Action-on-Action/168088979881738 and on Twitter at http://twitter.com/actiononaction.

[Snorzac]

Since I don't have enough space to type this out on Twitter I am going to put this here and hope you read it.

My problem with you is that all you do is provide criticism to the problems with the service however not once have I seen you providing a suggestion of how to fix the problem you are complaining about. A lobby group such as your's needs to be able to provide feedback on what could be done to fix the problem and they need to be realistic!

[ACTIONonACTION]

There are a lot of problems with the service that need fixing. Fixing them is a matter of all parties - ACTION, TAMS, the political government and community groups, coming together and solving them. There are a lot of options that can be explored to repair some of the significant problems with the service.
It is our goal to draw attention in the community and to the ACT Government of widespread dissatisfaction with the system. If we have specific recommendations,  you can be assured we will make them. If you have recommendations you'd like considered, feel welcome to add your voice to the chorus.

[Buzz Killington]

Obviously we have members here that are passionate about different aspects of public transport, so I'd just like to ask everyone to keep any ensuing debate civilised - the moderators won't hesitate to remove posts that cross the line.

This is certainly not directed at anyone in particular, but rather based on a past thread that got a little heated.

[Barry Drive]

Also you need to accept that some people do know more about Public Transport than you do. And that when people ask you to justify your statements, they are not being critical, negative or hostile - they are actually wanting you to provide more detail to support your argument.

[ACTIONonACTION]

We certainly are aware of and accept that. However, there do seem to be people who rather unreasonably object to our existence and goals, believing the system cannot or should not be improved. These people have a right to that opinion but we believe it's unjustified.

[Buzz Killington]

I don't think there would be anyone here who would claim that the system itself cannot or should not be improved.

[Snorzac]

What I am trying to say is that pointing out problems will do nothing unless you can provide a possible solution to the problem, and that not doing so will get us no-where, yes ACTION leaves a lot to be desired, so does every other transport provider in the country. What they are doing at the moment is the best they can do with available resources so really, unless you want to become a driver and/or fork out for more buses I say good on you, that is the only way we can fix anything!

[Buzz Killington]

unless you want to become a driver and/or fork out for more buses I say good on you, that is the only way we can fix anything!

I'd disagree with that point. There is a level in validity with examining how things are done and suggesting workable solutions.

[Barry Drive]

However, there do seem to be people who rather unreasonably object to our existence and goals, believing the system cannot or should not be improved.

There is a difference between "objecting" and suggesting that you be realistic.

[Snorzac]

What they need to do to fix things is start from scratch with the whole network (which they may do ). By doing this they may be able to stamp out inefficiencies such as a Belconnen shift that goes empty to Lanyon, does two 19s and returns to Belconnen (a former shift). This can be done by things like on road change overs and different rostering practices, both of which the union are against for reasons unknown.

[belcodriver]

What they need to do to fix things is start from scratch with the whole network (which they may do ). By doing this they may be able to stamp out inefficiencies such as a Belconnen shift that goes empty to Lanyon, does two 19s and returns to Belconnen (a former shift). This can be done by things like on road change overs and different rostering practices, both of which the union are against for reasons unknown.

Rosters change all the time without the union objecting. Without you being more specific I think what the union rightly objects to is a) management getting carte blanche to change rostering practices as they see fit and b) rostering changes to the considerable detriment of drivers such as 30 shits per depot with rostered weekend work.

[Snorzac]

Yes rosters change is not what but that I am getting at, it is the rostering practice, moving to a Sydney Buses style of rostering for example, the driver picks a starting time slot based on his/her seniority and in that time slot the is X number of shifts that the driver may do throughout the week, ranging from 7 hours to ten hours, the driver might to a shorter shift on one day and a few longer ones or might do four ten hour shifts and have a day off. This still gives 40 hours a week, but not necessarily split evenly over the five days.

By doing this you have a more efficient network, for example Hawker College has a Thursday only school run, so four days a week there is a bus that has an hour to do nothing in. By rostering using the above mentioned method of rostering each day would have the shifts based around what needs to be done on that day of the week, so the bus would be re-assigned to another run making more use of the resources at hand.

(You see what I am doing here Action on ACTION? I am providing ideas to fix problems, not just complaining with no constructive feedback at all)

[ACTIONonACTION]

There are many solutions that could be tried to ACTION's problems. Our mission is to draw the government's attention to those problems so they can find solutions. One of the biggest problems is the underfunding of the service, which we want to make a higher priority for the ACT government.

[Sir Pompously]

It is great to say there are so many solutions, but it is up to the person complaining to offer a helpful solution. We can all complain, I do it often, however I try my hardest to ensure I come up with a solution or multiple solutions to a problem for the company or group to try or at least debate about at their round tables. We can draw attention to problems, however just drawing attention does not help, instead it makes a group come off as just a complaint group with no substance.

At my place of work if we have a problem, we are encouraged to offer a solution to the problem. I have offered solutions to many problems at my workplace, and some of them are discussed at management meetings and every now and then are in place fully or at least part of the idea moves forward. When I was in the MyWay trial I found problems with the system, in my feedback I provided the problem and a possible solution to that problem. I am yet to see any implemented, but I still felt better to offer a solution rather than just complain.

In short, I disagree with your mission that you draw attention to the problem, and then leave it for the Government to find a solution. I feel that the Government is there to find a solution, but it is a team effort between both the people and the Government to ensure a solution to problems can be found.

[Barry Drive]

Let's take your mission to have a more "effective online charging" system - you need to demonstrate that the current system is ineffective and that there are better way(s) for it to work.

Your homework is to do the following: 1 research how the BPAY system works 2 research how the MyWay payment architechture works 3 research how similar Smartcard systems handle online top-ups. Only then will you be in a position to offer an opinion about whether MyWay can be more effective.

[ACTIONonACTION]

If you don't believe the system needs improvement, or can be improved, or should be improved, that's your choice.
We will continue advocating for increased funding and more effective and efficient system.
We won't claim to have all the answers. We are voters and consumers and we will approach the situation from that perspective.
We are not saying the system can be improved in all areas.
We are saying there are grounds for improvement, and we are drawing attention to where these grounds are.
When a solution is obvious, we will offer one. When it isn't, we will accept that but we will not simply agree that nothing can be done.
We will not shut up and live with the situation if the situation isn't good enough.

[Snorzac]

Yes but it is useless to just point out the problems as I am sure they are already aware of them!!

I won't bother going on as I am pretty much just going to say what Sir P said.

[ACTIONonACTION]

They may well be aware of them.
They aren't doing anything about them.
Canberra has had sub-par transport services for decades. It's time that changed, and it's lobbying for that change which is our main mission.

[Barry Drive]

You never want to listen to anyone else, do you? Don't worry about facts or anything. "This is my opinion and I'm going to keep restating it regardless of whether there are any facts to support it."

[ACTIONonACTION]

Well it's clear your opinion differs from ours. That's the way it is.

[Barry Drive]

Well it's clear your opinion differs from ours. That's the way it is.

My opinion is that I like to do my research before I start spouting off saying "FIX IT FIX IT FIX IT, WON'T SOMEBODY DO SOMETHING". If you do not understand why things work the way they do, you will have zero credibility when it comes to lobbying for change.

You have admitted (via Twitter) that you don't know how the BPAY system can be made to work more quickly, yet you keep saying that you believe that it can be. You think that TAMS are aware of the problem and yet are not doing anything about it. Perhaps TAMS is more likely to put its faith in Downer/Parkeon who actually build these systems than someone who admits to not knowing the first thing about how bank payment and Smartcard systems work and who also refuses to actually do any research to find out.

[Sir Pompously]

If you don't believe the system needs improvement, or can be improved, or should be improved, that's your choice.
We will continue advocating for increased funding and more effective and efficient system.
We won't claim to have all the answers. We are voters and consumers and we will approach the situation from that perspective.
We are not saying the system can be improved in all areas.
We are saying there are grounds for improvement, and we are drawing attention to where these grounds are.
When a solution is obvious, we will offer one. When it isn't, we will accept that but we will not simply agree that nothing can be done.
We will not shut up and live with the situation if the situation isn't good enough.

It is not a factor of not believing the system should not be improved, you will find many here who do believe the system can be improved and should be improved. The difference is that we actually put our plans on paper (Or.... on a computer screen) and allow others access to our routes, our designs. We have opinions and we have suggestions and being in this group you will get people who know alot more than you do offering their help to criticise or accept the suggestion you have put up. We are a team, many of us here have met face to face. We work together to help each other, whether it is a suggestion about a network or system change, to photography, we are here to offer helpful suggestions. If the Government read this site, and gain something from it then that is a win for them.

To each of your Beliefs:

If you don't believe the system needs improvement, or can be improved, or should be improved, that's your choice.

The majority of us believe the system needs improvement, and should be improved not just modified

We will continue advocating for increased funding and more effective and efficient system.
We will never say no to increased funding, but how will ACTION recieve this funding and from where? I say get rid of the public art program as all that has brought us is a parcel in the city and a pile of junk next to Gungahlin drive.

We won't claim to have all the answers. We are voters and consumers and we will approach the situation from that perspective.
And Voters and Consumers have answers. Complaining for the sake of complaining gets old, tired and turns the company away from a group. Complaining and offering suggestions is a better solution.

We are not saying the system can be improved in all areas.
I sort of get the impression you are, but I will wait and see what comes of your group before I comment any further.

We are saying there are grounds for improvement, and we are drawing attention to where these grounds are.
It is great to do so, but get the group together, get some TAMS reps in, complain and offer suggestions. Draw attention to the grounds, and then make a suggestion on improving the problem. They will sit there with their yellow legal pad and take it down. When they get back to their offices, they have something solid to work with.

When a solution is obvious, we will offer one. When it isn't, we will accept that but we will not simply agree that nothing can be done.
Obvious problems don't usually come with an obvious solution. Alot of the time, an obvious problem is known, but for logistical reasons the obvious solution is deemed pointless. The best way is to write in with the problem and the solution and ask for feedback. They will tell you if it can be an easy fix, or if it is a little harder due to *Blank*.

We will not shut up and live with the situation if the situation isn't good enough.
That is great but offer some help. Like I said, you will not be listened to if you are a group that jumps up and down and does nothing.

[Buzz Killington]

After a breakdown this morning I made the comment via the ACT Bus Twitter account that ACTION should be on twitter to communicate the breakdowns and canceled runs to commuters. (I also mentioned late buses but as MyWay correctly points out, that would be a huge job - unless a tolerance level of say, 10 minutes is set, perhaps?).

Minimal effort is required. All that needs to be done is have an account set up (free), promoted (costs nothing if you promote it online via the ACTION/TAMS/Transport for Canberra sites/Twitter/Facebook) and have somebody tasked to have Twitter opened on their desk at ACTION each day.

"Route 5 Northbound from Woden @ 0830hrs breakdown. Next service departs Woden @0850"

This is the sort of thing I'd like to see from Action on ACTION. Identify a problem (Communication to patrons of breakdowns, cancellations) and offer a viable solution.

[ACTIONonACTION]

A Twitter notification service is a very good idea for communicating delays and cancellations.

[Barry Drive]

A notification system would also be very useful for drivers. You often get passengers asking what happened to a certain bus. It shouldn't be too hard to send updates through the current radio/data system.

[ACTIONonACTION]

A notification system would also be very useful for drivers. You often get passengers asking what happened to a certain bus. It shouldn't be too hard to send updates through the current radio/data system.

We agree. Purely out of interest, why doesn't this already happen? Is it just due to expense?

[Snorzac]

I am pretty sure it is due to drivers not recognizing the capability of the technology installed in the bus. There is a small computer in each bus that the driver must sign onto but I have never seen it used.

From what I have been told it can be used to send text messages out, ie. informing drivers of road closures, traffic accidents, brake downs on other runs, available overtime, etc.

[Busnerd]

The radio system is set up so that the radio room can send text messages to buses. This is how flexibus was run in that passengers requested a pickup and the request was sent from the radio room via a short text message which appears on the drivers radio screen.